2019 Coronavirus (SARS-CoV-2) hits the UK

I agree on being careful, its a pity one of the most at risk groups , the elderly, appears to ignore this. (At leat around where I do they do this. Not wearing masks, congregating less than 2 metres from each other)

If a properly resourced test and traced managed by the NHS was implemented, then properly resourced, after lockdowns relaxed cases could be managed and risk reduced.

This is what other countries who managed covid crisis better than the UK have done.

In UK there is still time to follow that policy , but to do properly would need 14 day quarantine on inbound International travel as well. Which is what majority of countries containing covid 19 have done.

Which Johnson shows no sign of being interested in.

Whilst it can't be completely eliminated, this would allow a return to as normal as is possible without a working vaccine.

I notice Scotland are doing 5 tiers, will interested, to see in areas that have lower tiers to see what measures are relaxed.

Maybe that might allow some more normality, but full information not yet released on the plans.
It is true about some groups of older people being pretty lax. They are all masked up in shops but often keep no distance. Lack of checking at airports and lack of quarantine for visitors and returners to the UK baffles me. It looks like in Thailand now they will reduce quarantine to 10 days having measured it for months and 3 tests taking place during the period. It has been mentioned on the forum that countries like Thailand, China, Korea etc have a more compliant population which is major reason for the virus going down. Interestingly though if you look at Thailand now who were compliant regarding the virus they are not compliant regarding the attack on democracy there. I suspect it is to do with the strength of family relationships and protecting their parents
 
There is also the idiotic opinion that "If you are 'clinically extremely vulnerable' you should be still shielding". Which is stupid as shielding 'paused' on August 1st. Try telling your boss that you are still 'clinically extremely vulnerable' and you don't want to leave the house. "Shielding? That stopped didn't it? Get your ass to Mars, sorry, work."
 
There is also the idiotic opinion that "If you are 'clinically extremely vulnerable' you should be still shielding". Which is stupid as shielding 'paused' on August 1st. Try telling your boss that you are still 'clinically extremely vulnerable' and you don't want to leave the house. "Shielding? That stopped didn't it? Get your ass to Mars, sorry, work."


Shielding is not the same for everyone and it covers a whole multitude of conditions.
I dont think its idiotic for people with cancers, that can cause their immune system to be compromised and more likely to catch covid 19, or for people with serious copd issues. For People in these groups and others at serious risk, the threat of life changing complications or death has not gone away. And they need to continue to be very careful in their lives.

What pausing shielding did, was let people in these groups make their own minds up about what is acceptable to them. Information on risks were provided showing what risks were to different activities in relation to their health. They could then decide on personal risks which they were happy with or not. ( at least in Scotland it was, where personalised letters, based on their condition, were sent out to all people shielding)

Some will be happy to not follow shielding anymore and and to not make any changes to how they live, whilst others will be continue to be careful. It doesnt mean they stay indoors all week, but may want to avoid people in busy areas etc and restrict face to face interaction with people. It is a personal decision now.

And if they are in job, where they can work effectively from home then, they should be allowed to do this.
Current acas and unions advice for people in shielded group is "where a worker can continue to work from home , this should be supported."

Obviously this does not apply to everyone as not all people will be lucky enough, to be in jobs that are able to be done from home.

But if they are unable to work from home, then occupational health should be involved in a personal risk assessment to ensure that all measures required for their safety are identified and taken.
 
I dont think its idiotic for people with cancers, that can cause their immune system to be compromised and more likely to catch covid 19, or for people with serious copd issues.

Where did I say it was? The assumption that people can continue to shield, after it has been paused, is idiotic. I know of many people who have been forced to return to 'COVID safe(ish)' places of work because shielding has paused.

The 'clinically extremely vulnerable' still are, nothing has changed. But now, with the shielding paused, it is a very grey area for people who do not feel safe enough to go to work. I know of people who have broke down in tears when someone used their mug or their workstation for a few days while they were not in. Little things I know, but not for someone trying to be careful.
 
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A someone who runs a small business that will probably struggle over the winter I'm much much happier today with the changes announced by the chancellor.

It could well mean the difference between the business folding or being in a strong position to take advantage of next summer.
 
I'm glad for you @Mevlock obviously, but it's amazing what a little shake of that magic money tree finds.

The announcement today has just highlighted the inadequacy of this tier system, and how ill-thought out it was before inception.

I fear for lives of course, but I also fear for business and the longer term prospects of the economy with such recklessness and incompetence behind the wheel on this.
 
Where did I say it was? The assumption that people can continue to shield, after it has been paused, is idiotic. I know of many people who have been forced to return to 'COVID safe(ish)' places of work because shielding has paused.

The 'clinically extremely vulnerable' still are, nothing has changed. But now, with the shielding paused, it is a very grey area for people who do not feel safe enough to go to work. I know of people who have broke down in tears when someone used their mug or their workstation for a few days while they were not in. Little things I know, but not for someone trying to be careful.


Sorry misunderstood your post.

Yes the shielding paused statement, has been exploited by some employers, even some government ones.

If anyone does experience this if in a workplace with union representation they should raise with their union. As previously mentioned ACAS/unions are fully supportive of working from home where possible for members of shielded group.

For someone in the shielded group, its shocking to hear that their workstations are being used by others and their mug. Im really shocked at that and agree it would be very stressful and cause extreme anxiety to individuals affected in this way.

Ideally there should be no hot desking in any way and if in a job that is at a desk all day, their employer should be trying to help them work from home.

There is no excuse for any larger or state employer not allowing remote working. State employers and large corporations all have existing infrastructure and technologies which before covid appeared, already allowed remote working by employees.
 
Sorry misunderstood your post.

Yes the shielding paused statement, has been exploited by some employers, even some government ones.

If anyone does experience this if in a workplace with union representation they should raise with their union. As previously mentioned ACAS/unions are fully supportive of working from home where possible for members of shielded group.

For someone in the shielded group, its shocking to hear that their workstations are being used by others and their mug. Im really shocked at that and agree it would be very stressful and cause extreme anxiety to individuals affected in this way.

Ideally there should be no hot desking in any way and if in a job that is at a desk all day, their employer should be trying to help them work from home.

There is no excuse for any larger or state employer not allowing remote working. State employers and large corporations all have existing infrastructure and technologies which before covid appeared, already allowed remote working by employees.

without going into details, I can one hundred percent say, that in regards to your last point, that’s not true and you would be very very surprised just what companies and business and services don’t have the infrastructure !

it’s scary

also, I’m regards to unions, I am again aware of one who, since all this started, has made no contact with its members in relation to any of this and that’s in relation to one of the bigger unions
 
without going into details, I can one hundred percent say, that in regards to your last point, that’s not true and you would be very very surprised just what companies and business and services don’t have the infrastructure !

it’s scary

also, I’m regards to unions, I am again aware of one who, since all this started, has made no contact with its members in relation to any of this and that’s in relation to one of the bigger unions

I know state employers have vpn and citrix infrastructure as do the banks and insurance companies. Medium sizes ones maybe not, but I know ones in financial services do. Very large Multinationals definitely do have the infrastructure as its how they operate.

I think if the union is contacted, they will be supportive as nationally the big unions on their websites have information on this. And all advise for shielded group to work from home wherever possible.

Covid-19 Coronavirus - Guidance for unions (updated 16 April)

Coronavirus Work Rights | UK Advice for Coronavirus from Unite

Coronavirus: your rights at work | UNISON National

https://www.usdaw.org.uk/Help-Advice/Coronavirus-Update
 
The trouble is when many people talk about working from home they're thinking about office jobs, but there will be many roles and/or industries that not office based and not able to work from home.
 
I test smart devices so am able to work from home fortunately.
 

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So the test and trace system continues to go backwards. And so does the time for turning around tests.

Then we get this. No wonder it's completely fudgeed. The left hand doesn't know what the right hand is doing.

And it's gonna end up costing us billions.

IMG_20201023_014543.jpg
 
They have to do something to make it look like we are beating it. Next, cases only recorded if you're called Colin.

Worryingly, if track & trace is the only way to avoid a full lockdown it isn't looking good.
 
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Basically nobody on either side trusts any of the figures :rotfl:
 
I've put TT number on blocked list. Getting constant calls and same repeat msg despite already being provided with all details on Wed. No wonder people are not installing app and refusing to answer calls.
 
I've put TT number on blocked list. Getting constant calls and same repeat msg despite already being provided with all details on Wed. No wonder people are not installing app and refusing to answer calls.

I may have missed your post on it before, but are you having to isolate then?

My mate's stepson keeps getting calls to isolate, even though he has already isolated for 14 days and is now carrying on as normal. But either no-one he speaks to updates the system, or different callers from different areas ringing him don't have access to the same database.

I highly doubt these are isolated cases, it's a complete shambles. Very likely people isolating who don't need to be, and people not isolating who should be.
 
yes. Had first symptoms on 12th and isolating since then. Work tried to arrange test but as I was having fever and unable to drive, opted for home test kits. Received positive test after a week !! Not that it would've mattered. My original quarantine end date was 21st and no symptoms now apart from few coughs but I've already got a week off extension from work.

Sounds like similar issues to your mate's stepson. The call takes close to 40 mins and GL if anyone is struggling with cough.

Edit: not being reckless. Always wore mask, good hygiene and kept SD where ever possible. There was no tracing contact history even going further back to start of the month apart from work place. Work and home, nothing interesting for them.
 
Feel sorry for the NHS frontline workers,who are still getting over the first wave :(


On top of it all they have prats like this to deal with :mad:




 



Keep the test and trace info coming Steve. The sooner the better for those who don't know to wake up to the fact it doesn't have to be this way.

Yes other European countries are struggling too, but we can't do anything about them. We just need to fix our approach from the shambles it is now, and prevent more loss of life and the economy from going down the toilet.
 

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