HomePlug FAQ *Part 2*

Pawson6844

Active Member
@Pawson6844 Some of the newer/faster homeplugs can cause problems with VDSL broadband as they operate on the same frequencies, the interference can end up causing hundreds of crc errors which results in your broadband dropping. You say the network problems disappear once you have turned them off?
If the homeplug is plugged in close to the telephone socket, you could try moving it a bit further away if any other power sockets are available. I'd be interested to know whether that alleviates the problem.
I’ll have a look at this. The home plug is at max reach of the Ethernet cable as it is. I’d have to get a longer. Cable to try it.
Actually bringing this up, I turn them off every weekend when they are not in use and the whole system has improved, not sure if that’s just a coincidence
 
@Pawson6844 Some of the newer/faster homeplugs can cause problems with VDSL broadband as they operate on the same frequencies, the interference can end up causing hundreds of crc errors which results in your broadband dropping. You say the network problems disappear once you have turned them off?
They operate on frequencies between 2 and 300MHz and can cause interference to FM and DAB radio, air traffic control, SW radio, and all manor of emergency services as well. There have been numerous threads on here about it and quite frankly I'm surprised they have not been banned.
Various organisations such as the RSGB have been campaigning about them for years. Your best bet is to abandon them and put in CAT6 cable.

Welcome to Ban Power Line Technology
 

tom 2000

Well-known Member
I’ll have a look at this. The home plug is at max reach of the Ethernet cable as it is. I’d have to get a longer. Cable to try it.
Actually bringing this up, I turn them off every weekend when they are not in use and the whole system has improved, not sure if that’s just a coincidence
There was a time a while back that my homeplugs benefited from being reset. So I threw them all out and bought four new ones. I have noticed that if one is not plugged in firmly say as a result of pussy activity the entire network can be flaky.
 

David Chapman

Active Member
Hi, some help please...

I just replaced my 25 year old bedroom TV (see: Answered - What 32" TV to buy for co-ax input from Humax box?) with a Smart TV. Sony KDL32WE613.

Ran a speed test in the bedroom before purchase at 17Mbps, and had been advised I'd need 25Mbps for UHD, less for HD. The TV's internet Apps, iplayer, 5, etc., are running very slow if at all, so I need to boost my wi-fi signal.

We're on BT fibre and in the study downstairs, approx 15m away from the bedroom TV, and there's an Openreach (fibre?) box plugged into the telephone socket on the study wall. An ethernet cable goes from this to the input of the plusnet router. This provides wi-fi to the house.

The bedroom is in the original house, the router in an extension. The electric circuits for each may run separately which might rule out a solution using the mains to run the wi-fi signal boost. How would I find out if this is the case? Is it as simple as flicking off the main breaker on each consumer unit in turn and seeing if the study and bedroom sockets both go dead at the flick of one of them?

What are the best solutions to boost my signal to the bedroom, and whilst I'm at it, to the lounge TV 12m away which has a fire stick installed (it's on the original house electric circuit too, same as the bedroom). If I can't discover whether the bedroom and lounge are on the router mains circuit, what else would be good to boost wi-fi without using the mains as a host?

Many thanks for any help.
 

Dodgexander

Moderator
Hi, some help please...

I just replaced my 25 year old bedroom TV (see: Answered - What 32" TV to buy for co-ax input from Humax box?) with a Smart TV. Sony KDL32WE613.

Ran a speed test in the bedroom before purchase at 17Mbps, and had been advised I'd need 25Mbps for UHD, less for HD. The TV's internet Apps, iplayer, 5, etc., are running very slow if at all, so I need to boost my wi-fi signal.

We're on BT fibre and in the study downstairs, approx 15m away from the bedroom TV, and there's an Openreach (fibre?) box plugged into the telephone socket on the study wall. An ethernet cable goes from this to the input of the plusnet router. This provides wi-fi to the house.

The bedroom is in the original house, the router in an extension. The electric circuits for each may run separately which might rule out a solution using the mains to run the wi-fi signal boost. How would I find out if this is the case? Is it as simple as flicking off the main breaker on each consumer unit in turn and seeing if the study and bedroom sockets both go dead at the flick of one of them?

What are the best solutions to boost my signal to the bedroom, and whilst I'm at it, to the lounge TV 12m away which has a fire stick installed (it's on the original house electric circuit too, same as the bedroom). If I can't discover whether the bedroom and lounge are on the router mains circuit, what else would be good to boost wi-fi without using the mains as a host?

Many thanks for any help.
Are you sure that the slowness of the apps is caused by the internet? Could you plug in a laptop when it is running slow to check the speed again? I have a lot of experience with powerline woes and it could be something temperamental, but it can also just be the TV being slow. Another way you could test since its a relatively small TV is just to try it wired directly next to your router and see if the apps are still running the same.
 

David Chapman

Active Member
Are you sure that the slowness of the apps is caused by the internet? Could you plug in a laptop when it is running slow to check the speed again? I have a lot of experience with powerline woes and it could be something temperamental, but it can also just be the TV being slow. Another way you could test since its a relatively small TV is just to try it wired directly next to your router and see if the apps are still running the same.
I ran a Plusnet speed test on my phone in the bedroom at the same time as the TV apps were running slow. Still at 17Mbps.

I read a few FAQs on Sony's web site, this one in particular: The Wi-Fi signal drops or intermittently disconnects. (For TVs other than Android TV) | Sony UK

It suggests using 5 GHz router frequency. Then I Googled my router and found it's crap: Plusnet Hub Zero 2704n review
It only does 2.4 GHz.

Now, yesterday the broadband went down and Plusnet technical reckoned the router may be the issue, although it came back on later. They're sending me a "more up to date" router, despatched yesterday. I'm guessing the first thing to do is to try this out before other solutions.

Is the 5 GHz thing a red herring? Any other settings I should try on the new router if simply plugging it in doesn't do the trick?

I randomly found this on Plusnet community: 2.4ghz and/or 5ghz best practice? - Plusnet Community

My advanced settings show "wi-fi mode" as set to "up to 144 mb/s". Tried changing this to up to 300 mb/s but this slows down the speed to 14Mbps. I'll stop there before I break something!
 

Dodgexander

Moderator
I ran a Plusnet speed test on my phone in the bedroom at the same time as the TV apps were running slow. Still at 17Mbps.

I read a few FAQs on Sony's web site, this one in particular: The Wi-Fi signal drops or intermittently disconnects. (For TVs other than Android TV) | Sony UK

It suggests using 5 GHz router frequency. Then I Googled my router and found it's crap: Plusnet Hub Zero 2704n review
It only does 2.4 GHz.

Now, yesterday the broadband went down and Plusnet technical reckoned the router may be the issue, although it came back on later. They're sending me a "more up to date" router, despatched yesterday. I'm guessing the first thing to do is to try this out before other solutions.

Is the 5 GHz thing a red herring? Any other settings I should try on the new router if simply plugging it in doesn't do the trick?

I randomly found this on Plusnet community: 2.4ghz and/or 5ghz best practice? - Plusnet Community

My advanced settings show "wi-fi mode" as set to "up to 144 mb/s". Tried changing this to up to 300 mb/s but this slows down the speed to 14Mbps. I'll stop there before I break something!
I'm a little confused by this because you posted this in a homeplug FAQ thread. Are you using homeplugs or just wifi?

Homeplugs will be for a wired connection to the router, they have nothing to do with wireless.

If just using Wifi its a common issues that TVs wifi is poor, you just need a better quality signal delivered to the TV. A new router may make this better or worse, 5ghz is not better for range at all but once you have the new one set up, see if you see the same problem.

Also, try what I said before, plug in with a wire between the TV and the router and see if its still as slow.
 

David Chapman

Active Member
I'm considering Homeplug as an option to get a better signal to the TV(s). When I say "wi-fi" I should have said "internet signal", apologies.

But if I can't use the mains, a wi-fi extender could be the answer. New router has arrived, a Hub One, so I'll set it up and take it from there...
 

David Chapman

Active Member
New router in. Connection at TV failed. Phone wi-fi speed test shows 0.2Mbps download speed in the bedroom now! 28Mbps right by the router (dual band 2.4 & 5 Ghz).

...back to the old (crap) router I guess, plus a range extender maybe? Or home plug IF the mains is all connected on the same circuit.
 

tom 2000

Well-known Member
New router in. Connection at TV failed. Phone wi-fi speed test shows 0.2Mbps download speed in the bedroom now! 28Mbps right by the router (dual band 2.4 & 5 Ghz).

...back to the old (crap) router I guess, plus a range extender maybe? Or home plug IF the mains is all connected on the same circuit.
Homeplugs are really suck it and see. Having said that if your wiring is decent and nothing abnormal they should be a solution. I use a pair to link my out building to home internet with no issues. The speed is easily as good as the internet speed. If I was using it for fast data transfer it might be a different story but that doesn’t matter for the required function.
 

Venomx999

Active Member
Has anybody used BT's homeplugs ? If i need to get some i will probably go with them as my router/isp are BT too.
Will be using them for IPTV. I have fibre from BT



I was recommended them because apparently some T-Link ones can cause interference with VDSL or something
 
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wilsonlaidlaw

Novice Member
The last BT engineer who came to sort out a line fault, strongly recommended against using any powerline connectors unless you have a fibre internet feed. Apparently not only can they degrade your ADSL/VDSL download speed but also that of houses on the same copper lines land-line phone feed or power system. We are in the country and three houses share a mini-sub-station dropping the voltage from the local transmission line 11.6 Kv to 230v. A large part of our DSL issues turned out to be a neighbour using powerline connectors, generating RF noise on the power and phone lines. Although these will be marketed by BT they will be made by some anonymous company in China.
 

NeverEden

Distinguished Member
Glad this threads still going. I have a Q. I have a complete Wifi deadzone in the bedroom but the rest of the house is connected via powerline\wifi which works great.What I'd like is for the bedroom to get the wireless signal but NOT an amplified or boosted signal from the existing wifi. Does such a product exist where it takes the powerline connection and makes that stable/fast connection into a strong wifi signal? Essentially I want the wireless deadzone to be as close to the speed of the rest of the house.
 

Ged

Active Member
Glad this threads still going. I have a Q. I have a complete Wifi deadzone in the bedroom but the rest of the house is connected via powerline\wifi which works great.What I'd like is for the bedroom to get the wireless signal but NOT an amplified or boosted signal from the existing wifi. Does such a product exist where it takes the powerline connection and makes that stable/fast connection into a strong wifi signal? Essentially I want the wireless deadzone to be as close to the speed of the rest of the house.
Yes, assuming a standard power line works using that wiring then it should. I have used a solwise 1200 speed with WiFi to do this. If I remember correctly, it had a differing IP address from the usual 192.... but just logged in and changed it to something (static ip) below what the main router was issuing so I could find it easily.
 

NeverEden

Distinguished Member
Yes, assuming a standard power line works using that wiring then it should. I have used a solwise 1200 speed with WiFi to do this. If I remember correctly, it had a differing IP address from the usual 192.... but just logged in and changed it to something (static ip) below what the main router was issuing so I could find it easily.
That is exactly what I am after. ie. something on the same subnet. I'll look yours up. eek £60 ! Can you recommend another?
 

mickevh

Distinguished Member
...but NOT an amplified or boosted signal from the existing wifi.
The good news is, nothing can do that as it's physically impossible! :D

Pretty much any Powerline device that has a Wi-Fi AP built in should do what you want. I'm not an authority in powerline devices, but I suspect the "trick" will be to ensure that any additional powerline plugs you add to your existing fleet are "compatible" with the incumbents. (Not in terms of Wi-Fi, but for the over-the mains integration - new one needs to know how to "talk" to the existing ones.)

I've never seen any IP device that will not let you change it's IP address, so I doubt you need to "worry" about getting extra plug with the "right" subnet range for your existing network. Just ensure that whatever you change it to does not conflict with anything existing, including the DHCP range, as duplicate IP addresses are not allowed in IP LAN's. Maybe have a read of the "Using Two Routers Together" FAQ pinned in this forum, IIRC we put a brief explanation of IP addressing towards the end of the first post in that thread.
 
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NorvernRob

Distinguished Member
Evening all.

I’m having trouble with my Powerline setup since I changed routers. I have Sky fibre and 2 Solwise 500av Powerline adaptors. Setup in the usual way with one wired to the router with an Ethernet cable, the other plugged into a socket in my shed to extend the network out there.

With the old white Sky router I never had an issue - I just changed the SSID and password of the powerlines to match those of the router, and that worked perfectly. As soon as I changed to a Sky Q router I’ve had nothing but issues. I’ve changed the SSID and password to match the router as before. I get a full signal strength in the shed so everything appears to be working - and sometimes it does and I can connect, then the connection will drop and stay dropped even though I still have full signal.

Any ideas would be appreciated, I wish I hadn’t re-contracted with Sky tbh as their routers are complete pants even compared to a BT HH3 I had a few years ago - I’d get WiFi right down the garden with that.

Rob
 
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mickevh

Distinguished Member
It's almost certainly nothing to do with your new router in the sense of it somehow need to be "compatible" with your HomePlugs - most SOHO kit doesn't "talk" to each other in any meaningful way - essentially your router couldn't care less what is downstream of it, let alone somehow have to "integrate" with it and the same argument works in reverse in that your Homeplugs couldn't care less what's upstream of them. As long as everything talks "ethernet" to connect to each other and the IP addressing doesn't conflict then everything should be fine. Indeed, things like HomePlugs don't even need IP addresses to "work" - the IP is generally just there simply so that you can use a web browser to configure them - in normal service, IP isn't used (though of course plenty of IP packets are conveyed.)

I'm guessing somewhat, but it sounds more like either your client devices are doing something batty (there is a tendency to "blame the router" for all lost Wi-Fi connections, but is equally if not more likely that it was the client that dropped the session,) you've picked up a new interference source or maybe you have a radio channel conflict you didn't have before.

I suggest you start with some basic network hygiene. Check that all your infrastructure devices are using the same IP subnet and are not conflicting and enough time has elapsed for DHCP to have done it's thing and timed out any IP leases issued by your old router and issued leases from your new one - typically that takes 24 hours in SOHO kit.

Then have a look at your radio channel plan. I prefer not to use "auto" tuning in small SOHO deployments and set them manually. Check the radio channels in your router and plugs and ensure they differ.

In the 2.4GHz waveband, channels need to be "5 apart" so (for example) choose channels from the set [1,6,11.] I'd also disable 20/40MHz AKA "fat" or "wide" channels (nomenclature varies) in the 2.4GHz "N" protocol if your devices offer such choices (not all do.) That curtails top speed, but can yield more reliable performance.

In the 5GHz waveband, just ensure channels are different.

If you wanted to go the whole hog, you could get hold of a something like InSSIDer and try to avoid the radio channels the neighbours are using for optimum performance, though unfortunately freebie tools like InSSIDer don't show any "other" interference sources such as client devices, video senders, baby monitor, car alarms, microwave ovens, etc. etc.
 

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