Hunting With Hounds

Wow,
What the SNP has just done is a serious constitutional matter,
Plans To Change Fox Hunting Rules Pulled


Its not well done the SNP at all!
What they are doing is behaving like some obstreperous union.
This has little to do with hounds or foxes, as in Scotland they are allowed unlimited numbers of blood thirsty hounds!.

What they have done is voted on a matter that does not affect Scotland, against previous understandings, all because they know that the present government wants to change the rules so that Scottish MPs can't vote on English matter and vise versa.

I can't think of any thing more stupid, it will only hasten the split.
On the other hand this is what SNP wants anyway, so perhaps not stupid after all.

Hypocrisy or what?
Fox hunting is currently banned throughout Britain - but in Scotland an unlimited amount of dogs can be used by farmers or landowners to flush out foxes.


In England and Wales there is a limit of just two dogs and the Government had wanted to amend the law to bring it in line with Scotland.
Other than a few rabid right wingers - who don't want to talk too much about this legislation and just get it through quickly - I don't think there will be too much support for the Tories on this topic.

As for hastening the end of the Union, surely the Tories are to blame there by showing just where their priorities are. Red coats, trumpets and packs of hounds may appeal to the shires, but does little to show empathy or understanding with the average Glaswegian. Indeed one such chap who works for me described the Tories as "wired to the moon".
 
Other than a few rabid right wingers - who don't want to talk too much about this legislation and just get it through quickly - I don't think there will be too much support for the Tories on this topic.

As for hastening the end of the Union, surely the Tories are to blame there by showing just where their priorities are. Red coats, trumpets and packs of hounds may appeal to the shires, but does little to show empathy or understanding with the average Glaswegian.

That's not the bigger picture though. I have sympathies for the fox, but to me what the SNP has done is not about fox hunting. Otherwise they would bring Scotland into line with England and save Scottish foxes as well? But they could care less.

They have no intention of doing this do they?.... Which shows they are playing politics of the worst kind.
 
Chances are the "blue fox - conservatives against hunting" ,would burn Tory majority, with or without SNP. Cameron just had a spanking, a nice little jab and welcome to the reality of 12 MP majority.
 
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She knew exactly what she was doing. Which is forcing Cameron's hand to address the "English Votes" issue before he was ready to do so.

Additionally, it would seem that the SNP would prefer Scotland to align with England's current law, not vice versa, which is why they think they have a right to influence the vote here. Believe as much of that as you will :)
 
That Stur
They have no intention of doing this do they?.... Which shows they are playing politics of the worst kind.

Ahh well, the harsh reality of such small majority.
 
It was going to be a free vote anyway, so without the SNP it might have been rejected, and that would have been fine.
But N.S. was saying on TV that so many English people asked her to vote on this issue that she felt compelled. What a politician!
 
Wow,
What the SNP has just done is a serious constitutional matter,
Plans To Change Fox Hunting Rules Pulled
http://news.sky.com/story/1518602/plans-to-change-fox-hunting-rules-pulled

Perhaps if Cameron had given the SNP what was promised in the referendum, they might have got the vote done and dusted (but probably still lost). This just shows how fragile the Tory majority is, Cameron throwing his weight around will only in end tears. He needs to be like a wily fox to negotiate the hurdles ahead with a baying pack of rabid backbenchers, Labour and the SNP snapping at his heels.



Its not well done the SNP at all!
What they are doing is behaving like some obstreperous union.
This has little to do with hounds or foxes, as in Scotland they are allowed unlimited numbers of blood thirsty hounds!.

It has more to do with Cameron pushing ahead with Votes for English MP's and not delivering on the promise given to the Scottish. It's Nicola Sturgeon vs David Cameron. Round 1 to Sturgeon.

What they have done is voted on a matter that does not affect Scotland, against previous understandings, all because they know that the present government wants to change the rules so that Scottish MPs can't vote on English matter and vise versa.

Actually you'll find the current proposals only ban Scottish MP's from voting on the preliminary stages of a bill. It has to be voted through by the entire House in the final stages. Where the SNP could abstain or vote for or against a bill. It's a ham fisted attempt at constitutional change. Perhaps we need an English Parliament based in Birmingham or elsewhere in the North.

I can't think of any thing more stupid, it will only hasten the split.
On the other hand this is what SNP wants anyway, so perhaps not stupid after all.

Or you can look at as the Tories using Fox Hunting as a means to trap the SNP into saying they'd vote against it so that it gives the Tories an excuse to go further on English votes for English MP's when Parliament returns in September.

Hypocrisy or what?
Fox hunting is currently banned throughout Britain - but in Scotland an unlimited amount of dogs can be used by farmers or landowners to flush out foxes.


The Scottish Government is looking at changing the law in Scotland to bring into line with the rest of the UK. So they can argue that a change in the law in England weakens the case for changing the law in Scotland. How they stacks up is a judgement call for people to make in their own minds.


In England and Wales there is a limit of just two dogs and the Government had wanted to amend the law to bring it in line with Scotland.

And you'll find that the hunts in Scotland barely follow the rules (there is evidence that foxes have not been flushed out and shot as the law requires but instead ripped to shreds by hounds). Hence the Scottish Government looking into bringing the law in Scotland into line with England and Wales.
 
I admire the SNP, they have that political wherewithal lacking in the rest of Westminster.

This manoeuvring by the SNP will force the Tory's hand and hopefully make the government back down a notch or two on the arrogant front.
 
As @Cliff has mentioned it is an amendment to the current hunting law. There will still be a ban on riding to hounds hunting a fox. The Tories want to allow more than two hounds to flush out a fox so that it can be shot.

Now hounds are very good at sniffing out Basil Brush, but once the fox has gone to ground in it's den then either terriers have to be sent in, which I believe is still banned, or the den has to be dug out. Now if the hounds find and flush a fox in open country it is going to very hard to stop the pack catching a tearing the fox apart. The marksman will not take a shot in fear of hitting a hound. So the vast majority of those foxes flushed will not be shot but torn apart by the hounds. That's what hounds are historically bred to do.................hunt and kill.

Perhaps the farmers and the gentry should retrain their gundogs to flush or find foxes and they will simply point or sett on the fox. Obviously that's never going to happen because hounds hunt as a pack and have far more stamina than a gundog and the hunters want to follow the pack for the kill and for the sport and that is essentially want they want to return and simply don't like the plebeians interfering.

So good on the SNP.
 
Regardless of the cause, the simple fact of the matter is that the SNP have gone against their word that they wouldn't vote in English only matters.
 
the simple fact of the matter is that the SNP have gone against their word ...
so they're the same as all the other parties (incl UKIP)
 
Regardless of the cause, the simple fact of the matter is that the SNP have gone against their word that they wouldn't vote in English only matters.
To be pedantic this is an English and Welsh matter.
 
If we boiled this down to a local issue - if most of us had a neighbour who sat on his horse in his back garden, blew a trumpet and did horrid things to animals - I think the vast majority would say something. So I don't blame the SNP for getting involved at all.

As for this 'simply aligning the law with Scotland' I think the key here is priorities. The SNP has been focused on more important issues whereas, for the Tories, this is issue is so critical it has been rushed to the Commons within 100 days of the election. I suspect the SNP have now firmly got their sights set on a change to the law.
 
Nicola:
Anyone noticed David is being a dick?
David:
I will change the rules to shut you up.

Nuff said.
 
Nicola:
Anyone noticed David is being a dick?
David:
I will change the rules to shut you up.

Nuff said.
Also noticed that he is after tightening up strike laws.

I bet he used to/still does beat off to Maggie Thatcher all the time
 
Any bets on when N.S. will change the hunting law in Scotland to align with England? (that must stick in her throat!
 
I think she's far more of a nuanced politician to be bothered about that aspect of it. If anything it's just the first shot in a long war of trolling the Tory party into making mistakes.
 

Response from local MP:

"Thank you for contacting me about fox hunting. I can assure you that I am 100% opposed to fox hunting and I will vote against any attempt to overturn or water-down the hunting ban. I am pleased that this Tory government has dropped its most recent attempt to water-down the hunting ban.

I and other Labour MPs will continue to campaign to keep fox hunting banned and to defeat any future attempt this Tory government will make to change the current law."
 
I live in a rural area and couldn't care less whether they kill foxes with shotgun, hound or breeze block. I never really understood the fuss about it, either way.
 

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