Answered Is a wideband ariel a waste of money?

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I'm in Southampton so Rowridge is my nearest transmitter. The digital.co.uk coverage predictor gives me green on all channels, but I'm not getting BBC News HD, 4Seven HD, etc.

I have a band A ariel which covers groups 21 to 37, so I'm not getting COM7 HD and COM8 HD as they are on 55 and 56, which explains the missing channels. So obviously I could swap my ariel for a wideband one. Is this a good idea? I don't want to swap ariel only to find out later that they are closing down COM7 and 8, or moving them into the 21 to 37 range. Doe anyone know the future plan please?
 
COM7/8 will close in 2022; or a bit sooner or a bit later. But no-one knows for sure quite when (or if they do, they aren't telling).

Of course if the aerial is in the loft or otherwise easily accessible, then d-i-y swapping it for a log periodic is relatively cheap and may be worth the expense? (See ATV aerials website and the log 36 gain curve Gain (curves), Again ).
 
Yes it's in the loft so a DIY swap is possible. Thanks very much for the info. It looks like a T group ariel may be a good way of getting the extra channels for the next few years.
 
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It's aerial, Ariel is washing powder. Freeview have been replacing aerials free of charge when people complain about loss of com 7 and 8.
They put a Blake log periodic up for me foc.
 
It's aerial, Ariel is washing powder. Freeview have been replacing aerials free of charge when people complain about loss of com 7 and 8.
They put a Blake log periodic up for me foc.


Only if Freeview is your only source. If you have other ways like satellite you are not eligible. If you lied that's fraud and totally reprehensible. :eek:
 
Only if Freeview is your only source. If you have other ways like satellite you are not eligible. If you lied that's fraud and totally reprehensible. :eek:
I've lost a few channels recently also - BBC News HD for example. However, I am talking about my YouView box as these channels are stll available via Freeview tv. What do I need to do to have the same Freeview channels available on my tv and box? Or is that not possible?
 
I've lost a few channels recently also - BBC News HD for example. However, I am talking about my YouView box as these channels are stll available via Freeview tv. What do I need to do to have the same Freeview channels available on my tv and box? Or is that not possible?


Yes it's possible for a number of reasons. All tuners aren't equally sensitive, some will work with a weak signal, but this come with a tendency for stronger signals to overload the tuner front end which causes the output to be distorted. Try fitting a signal attenuator to the unit missing channels and reduce the level while keeping an eye on the signal quality. If it falls below 100% increase the signal level a bit to give you some bad weather margin

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I've lost a few channels recently also - BBC News HD for example. However, I am talking about my YouView box as these channels are still available via Freeview tv. What do I need to do to have the same Freeview channels available on my tv and box? Or is that not possible?
Location?
Which transmitter?
Your own or a shared aerial. If your own where is it (room, loft, outside)?
Predicted reception (use 'detailed view') is available here: Digital UK - Coverage checker

Moves of the COM7/8 muxes to ch 55/56 typically result in weaker reception - especially with out-of-band receiving aerials. Again, though as far as I know nothing has happened in this year so far Digital UK | Clearance events in 2019 and nothing in December last year either Digital UK | Clearance events in 2018

If its a move of frequency an attenuator will likely not help... but all TVs and YouView boxes have signal meters built in that will give a better clue to us if you post the numbers for all multiplexes received. If TV fed from YV box RF loop through, with power saving off, that will amplify the signal slightly and might account for the difference between them.

But do the basics first: Go over all TV aerial connections - especially hand-made plugs - and fix any suspect / loose ones by re-making or replacing. Try different aerial fly leads. Keep hdmi and aerial cables well apart. (Hdmi and aerial cross-interference is common enough.)

Reception loss may be due to outside factors: wet foliage on trees that have grown up. Even normal gradual deterioration of the aerial and cables may cause this. (Average lifetime of an aerial install was always given as around the 12 years mark... Some will last longer and others less, of course.)
 
Thanks. Aerial on roof. Lead into lounge where there is a small splitter (about half the size of a fag packet). One lead then goes into YouView box and the other under flooring to another room in back of house. From box the rf lead goes under floor to tv in window. Aerial installed about 15 years ago. Was originally going to have 2 aerials but installer said it wasn't necessary and a small splitter was sufficient . He was right. I am in north London.
No trees nearby. Cabling is neat though what is happening under floor is anyone's guess. Never noticed any picture distortion which made me suspectt cabling. Crystal Palace transmitter. I lost a few channels a while back, probably late summer after a retune. Another retune a couple weeks ago and BBC 4 returned to the box but News 24 still missing.
I can live with it to be honest but wondered if it was due to aerial or YouView box being a bit naff.
 
I've had exactly the same recently. My TV picks up all the channels OK, but the Youview box doesn't get BBC News HD. My set up is the same as LX200GPS - a single aerial on the roof to a simple splitter, one output to the TV, one to the Youview. Yet the YV box doesn't get some of the channels, along with BBC News HD, that the TV picks up fine. I'm on the Belmont Tx
 
I can live with it to be honest but wondered if it was due to aerial or YouView box being a bit naff.
It's almost a certainty have a Group A aerial and the two COMs (7 & 8) in question have moved up in frequency and out of band for the aerial. Before you do anything else, try contacting Freeview as they have been known to fit a mores suitable aerial for free for some of the peeps who have lost those channels due to their shift in frequency.
I've had exactly the same recently.
Not sure if Belmont has done the same as above, but same answer if they have.
 
Not sure I would qualify for the freebie because although my box does not receive all the availabe Freeview channels my tv does. So they could argue I am not really missing out.
 
Thanks. Aerial on roof. Lead into lounge where there is a small splitter (about half the size of a fag packet). One lead then goes into YouView box and the other under flooring to another room in back of house.

From box the rf lead goes under floor to tv in window. Aerial installed about 15 years ago. Was originally going to have 2 aerials but installer said it wasn't necessary and a small splitter was sufficient . He was right. I am in north London.
Possibly a group A (and possibly not as few work at all well on 55/56, unlike widebands)

BUT re-arrange the cabling like this:
Aerial -> You view box direct (remove splitter)... Do the COM7/8 muxes now work reliably? What signal strength/quality do you get on all 8/9 muxes on box? Repeat numbers for TV attached to You View box.

Next try: You view box RF out -> splitter and feed the two TVs from the splitter that way? Do both TVs still work OK?

Relocating splitter gives You View box +4dB input and the other two sets should still be at more or less the same level.
You may, of course, need to get additional connecting cables etc.,.

NB. The splitter has one INput and two OUTputs. They should be marked but sometimes people can get it wrong when using cables to join things up and that messes up one TV set completely while the other is perfectly fine! Be careful not to do that.

++++++++++++++++++++++++

a single aerial on the roof to a simple splitter, one output to the TV, one to the Youview. Yet the YV box doesn't get some of the channels, along with BBC News HD, that the TV picks up fine. I'm on the Belmont Tx
Belmont has yet to move COM 7/8 frequencies to outwith a group A aerial (still 33 & 35 from Belmont).

The obvious thing to do (after checking for damaged aerial cables and dodgy plugs and sockets) is to lose that splitter which reduces the signal in to the box and TV by 4 dB (i.e. less than half to each).

Instead, utilise the RF pass through outlet from the box to feed the TV. You will need to disable the (default) power save in standby feature on the box to do so. But that's likely to pull the wanted signal from out of the noise floor for reliable reception (for a time at least). It will consume a little more electricity as a result, of course.

Belmont has three muxes at 150kW erp, two at 100kW one at 50kW and then COM7 at 37 & 8 41 kW. In fact not a bad signal level variation (a tad over 6dB at most).
 
Not sure I would qualify for the freebie because although my box does not receive all the availabe Freeview channels my tv does. So they could argue I am not really missing out.


If the TV does and the Humax does not, chances are a simple TV attenuator connected to the box input or just turn on power saving in sby and fit a 1 in 2 out splitter giving the TV and Humax a seperate signal.

If you use the attenuator while using the attenuator and viewing the Humax signal diagnostics try reducing the signal level to about 60% checking the quality remains at 100%

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In the past, I’ve always favoured a grouped aerial, but with so many mux changes on the way, a wideband seems a better bet to me, albeit at the risk of a little gain loss in the lower groups. I suppose however, that an older ‘real wideband’ aerial may carry a risk that it picks-up guff from the freed-up frequencies when they start getting used by mobile ‘phones — time will tell, I suppose.

Clem
 
I suppose however, that an older ‘real wideband’ aerial may carry a risk that it picks-up guff from the freed-up frequencies when they start getting used by mobile ‘phones — time will tell, I suppose.

Clem
Yes they do, but the tuner in your TV will reject it if not tuned there just as it would a TV channel there. If it is really strong and overloading fit a 4G filter which can be got free of charge.
 
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True, but it’s more guff that can cause issues. As I understand things, newer wideband aerials don’t cover those frequencies being released. Mine are old school, full channel range.

Clem
 
True, but it’s more guff that can cause issues. As I understand things, newer wideband aerials don’t cover those frequencies being released. Mine are old school, full channel range.
In part true, they designed the gain for group W widebands to cover UHF 21-68 originally.
Then came the reduced group T wideband 21-60 and soon the group K wideband 21-48 when 700 MHz clearance completes.

But many designs also incorporate the filters needed into the circuitry for the 'balun' between dipole and cable.

Separate filters cause problems because people (wrongly) plug them into devices and the extra weight causes mechanical strain on the UHF inputs. That also have a small insertion and inevitable termination loss, but that should be almost zero except close to the cut-off frequency.

I (still) have a Triax yagi aerial from the 90s that was 21-60 (a Norway special, iirc, back then). But it worked ok up to 68 when I used it on my caravan.
 

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