Lyngdorf MP-40

You should hear more detail with a Lyngdorf Processor but if you like what DIRAC or any other correction system is doing to your system, it will be because of the way they are changing the tonality of your speakers. Typically, this is rolling off the high frequency a little and if you like this or a Harman curve, go for it. This can sound nicer, but remember, once it’s been added by your room correction system, it cannot be re EQ’d out of the system.
You are missing an important caveat with Dirac here Rob, in that this only really applies if you use the Dirac default target curve.

It's actually very simple to mirror RP's frequency response tracking by only correcting below say 300Hz, just by moving the FR curtains. This is how my FL speaker measured with and without Dirac, and which looks remarkably like the equivalent trace with RP on.
 

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There is a little info in the manuals which you can download directly from the Lyngdorf site.

The attached is something I wrote that may be of interest. Its a very rough start but every room/system will require something different..........
 

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The moment you apply a target curve, whether its flat, a present one in the correction system or your own curve, you have changed the sound of your speakers forever.

RoomPerfects direct measurement, in conjunction with their software creates a target curve that’s unique to your room and your speakers. This is how it preserves their sound.

A nice looking frequency response does not equate to good sound. Its far more complex than this.
 
DIRAC or any other correction system is doing to your system, it will be because of the way they are changing the tonality of your speakers. Typically, this is rolling off the high frequency a little and if you like this or a Harman curve, go for it.

Dirac muted my highs which is one of the reasons I did not like it. You explaining how it rolls them off makes sense to me.
 
Dirac muted my highs which is one of the reasons I did not like it. You explaining how it rolls them off makes sense to me.

The Lyngdorf's are the only processors that get it right consistently with the least fuss. You may be able to get close or similar with others but you'll really have to roll up your sleeves.

If you hear enough of these systems over and over you get to hear their general sound.
 
You always hear other opinions too, though. I understand that @mb3195 did not like the Lyngdorf? Hence, him now owning a Trinnov.
 
Personal preference, isn't it. Why would you like the same sound as me or anyone else?
 
I would agree that personal preference plays a big role in this. I am patiently waiting for my MP-40 and will be interesting to compare Anthem ARC with RP in the same environment.
One thing that always bugged be is that I always preferred the sound of my previous Linn Kinos AV controller without any room correction other than delays than the Anthem D2v with ARC. For movies it was’t as noticeable but music was a night and day difference.
So looking forward to the MP-40 comparison and hopefully regain some of the sound quality I have been missing...
 
You always hear other opinions too, though. I understand that @mb3195 did not like the Lyngdorf? Hence, him now owning a Trinnov.

That's not what I mean tho. I'm talking about the consistency and ease of use to set up. I've heard all the processors several times in different rooms, the Lyngdorf is the most consistent sounding. This is not the same thing as personal preference. I could personally prefer a different processor in this room than what I have right now that would be harder to set up. I have not been swayed with all the info to hand so far to take another brand home to demo - if the demo rooms vs this room with the Lyngdorf was not up to scratch, I wouldn't own it and would indeed have something else.

Personal preference, isn't it. Why would you like the same sound as me or anyone else?

Why is there not 500 different types of piano sound? People are able to recognise the most pleasing traits of sound, that's how instruments and scales were invented, we all like the same sounds, the refinement of it is simply fidelity and tonality, then preference of that itself.


This is not avante garde modern art - Go up the scale in any musical instrument, you'll find it's limited to less than a handful in each category and the differences aren't massive either. Using the personal preference argument is subjective and anecdotal, it's an easy cop out with AV and fairly easily displaced with blind testing in a large enough sample size.


I would agree that personal preference plays a big role in this.

How many drummers would you say personally prefer cheaper cymbal brands over Zildjian, Sabian and Menil?

And Paiste if you hate yourself.
 
That's not what I mean tho. I'm talking about the consistency and ease of use to set up. I've heard all the processors several times in different rooms, the Lyngdorf is the most consistent sounding. This is not the same thing as personal preference. I could personally prefer a different processor in this room than what I have right now that would be harder to set up. I have not been swayed with all the info to hand so far to take another brand home to demo - if the demo rooms vs this room with the Lyngdorf was not up to scratch, I wouldn't own it and would indeed have something else.



Why is there not 500 different types of piano sound? People are able to recognise the most pleasing traits of sound, that's how instruments and scales were invented, we all like the same sounds, the refinement of it is simply fidelity and tonality, then preference of that itself.


This is not avante garde modern art - Go up the scale in any musical instrument, you'll find it's limited to less than a handful in each category and the differences aren't massive either. Using the personal preference argument is subjective and anecdotal, it's an easy cop out with AV and fairly easily displaced with blind testing in a large enough sample size.




How many drummers would you say personally prefer cheaper cymbal brands over Zildjian, Sabian and Menil?

And Paiste if you hate yourself.

Sorry Rock but personal preference does come into audio.

Take speakers for example. I, like a lot of people don’t like MK speakers, whereas you, plus many other do.

That’s personal opinion.
 
Sorry Rock but personal preference does come into audio.

Take speakers for example. I, like a lot of people don’t like MK speakers, whereas you, plus many other do.

That’s personal opinion.

But more people like them than don't, disproportionately in fact, given their userbase, heritage, reviews etc and that can be easily shown by the massive amount of owners and reviews on this very forum.

You didn't read and / or understand my full post or it's context at all - It's laid out quite clearly that there is personal preference and why, but also how it's used as a throwaway comment and how it can easily have light shone on it.

Floyd Toole has some experiments conducted on this. You can find on his lecture on youtube to remove most bias (preference). Preference while real, at the upper levels of instruments and familiar sounds is not a gaping abyss and comes down to minor shifts in tone, when the fidelity is assumed to be equal.
 
How many drummers would you say personally prefer cheaper cymbal brands over Zildjian, Sabian and Menil?

And Paiste if you hate yourself.

Rock, never mind us drummer types...we are a strange breed ;-)
 
But more people like them than don't, disproportionately in fact, given their userbase, heritage, reviews etc and that can be easily shown by the massive amount of owners and reviews on this very forum.

You didn't read and / or understand my full post or it's context at all - It's laid out quite clearly that there is personal preference and why, but also how it's used as a throwaway comment and how it can easily have light shone on it.

Floyd Toole has some experiments conducted on this. You can find on his lecture on youtube to remove most bias (preference). Preference while real, at the upper levels of instruments and familiar sounds is not a gaping abyss and comes down to minor shifts in tone, when the fidelity is assumed to be equal.

I’m not getting into a debate about how many people do or do like MK speakers, I know they have a massive fan base.

But, some people will like product A over product B, personal preference is always a thing in any subject matter.
 
I’m not getting into a debate about how many people do or do like MK speakers, I know they have a massive fan base.

But, some people will like product A over product B, personal preference is always a thing in any subject matter.

Don't bring it up then.

Again, now for the third time, have not disputed the existence of personal preference.
 
Rock, never mind us drummer types...we are a strange breed ;-)

Waiting for the jokes to roll in any time :rotfl: . I was going to also make the point how important it is to preserve the sound of your drum kit being recorded, altho it might make some people literally loose their minds - but you know what's involved in making that happen, not to mention how complex tuning, timbre, materials and dynamic range is..... oh wait this is exactly like audio reproduction damnit!

Maybe I should have used some dogshit car analogy instead, my bad.... or said something like 'next level' As someone who used to sell Linn, be interesting how you compare it to Lyngdorf.
 
Waiting for the jokes to roll in any time :rotfl: . I was going to also make the point how important it is to preserve the sound of your drum kit being recorded, altho it might make some people literally loose their minds - but you know what's involved in making that happen, not to mention how complex tuning, timbre, materials and dynamic range is..... oh wait this is exactly like audio reproduction damnit!

Maybe I should have used some dogsh*t car analogy instead, my bad.... or said something like 'next level' As someone who used to sell Linn, be interesting how you compare it to Lyngdorf.

I absolutely agree on preserving the original sound...this was the main reason I choose the original Linn kit and now Lyngdorf over others in my price range :thumbsup:

Matter of fact, I now start to wonder if I was not a big fan of the change Anthem made in sound quality was due to the fact that ARC‘s correction changed my speakers in-room interaction more so than poor implementation of their electronic components? My room is sub-optimal at best and would have thought some RC is better than none but...certainly not in my case.

To be honest I did not like Marantz + Audessy either but that was in a different room so not a direct comparison.

As far as ease of running RP, I can‘t say since I never used it but looking forward to my MP-40 in a week or so and how it compares to both my old Linn and Anthem ARC. All else will be the same so should be a valid comparison.

Will report back...now off to hit some Sonor kit! :D
 
I absolutely agree on preserving the original sound...this was the main reason I choose the original Linn kit and now Lyngdorf over others in my price range :thumbsup:

Matter of fact, I now start to wonder if I was not a big fan of the change Anthem made in sound quality was due to the fact that ARC‘s correction changed my speakers in-room interaction more so than poor implementation of their electronic components? My room is sub-optimal at best and would have thought some RC is better than none but...certainly not in my case.

To be honest I did not like Marantz + Audessy either but that was in a different room so not a direct comparison.

As far as ease of running RP, I can‘t say since I never used it but looking forward to my MP-40 in a week or so and how it compares to both my old Linn and Anthem ARC. All else will be the same so should be a valid comparison.

Will report back...now off to hit some Sonor kit! :D


Drums are a real good test, especially if you know how they're supposed to sound in the context of the mix and genre of music, but also great at exposing problem child systems.
I wouldn't have pegged ARC as being bad, but I certainly couldn't have left Audyssesy on it was 'as if millions of strangled geese suddenly cried out in terror, and were suddenly silenced.'

@donttrustgoats has done a room to room various room eq test and has plenty to say about it every now and again when he drops by and it all lines up pretty much as you'd expect. And while not to hurt the personal preference of anyone, you don't need to be a bat-dolphin hybrid to largely agree.

Running RP is a doddle - walk around your room putting the mic in weird positions of your choice, then face the wrath of the test tones... christ Lyngdorf, you better be doing something clever in there.
 
I just upgraded from a Arcam 860 to a MP-40, I have MK MP S300 Front speakers. With Dirac I was able to get a very good sound and a good looking graph, but it took a lot of work. Room Perfect is ridiculously easy, if time consuming, though you don't have to be in the room during tuning. I have room knowledge at 100% and I have to say that with minor voicing adjustment to tame the 300's a little, it sounds terrific. I don't even feel the need to measure and adjust. , which for me is most unusual.
 
I just upgraded from a Arcam 860 to a MP-40, I have MK MP S300 Front speakers. With Dirac I was able to get a very good sound and a good looking graph, but it took a lot of work. Room Perfect is ridiculously easy, if time consuming, though you don't have to be in the room during tuning. I have room knowledge at 100% and I have to say that with minor voicing adjustment to tame the 300's a little, it sounds terrific. I don't even feel the need to measure and adjust. , which for me is most unusual.

Have you tried listening to any movies with the MP-40, if so how does it compare to the Arcam.

Interested to know as I will be auditioning the Lyngdorf in the next couple of months with the intention of replacing an Arcam AVR550.
 
I have to say that with minor voicing adjustment to tame the 300's a little
Interesting that you say this, because I recently found that my 300s need a little taming too: I'd convinced myself that I should be listening to CDs with Dirac OFF, but after the recent Dirac update to V2xx and now V3 it seems to do a much better job with stereo music and I actually prefer it on now, which takes that slightly harsh edge off them.

It's good that the voicing can still allow some speaker tuning as the way Rob has been talking lately it sounds more like I'd be stuck with my speaker's sound if I ever went Lyngdorf route.
 
Have you tried listening to any movies with the MP-40, if so how does it compare to the Arcam.

I have only listened to some of the Dolby clips and the start of Roger Waters- The Wall. I thought that the detail was better. The Wall was outstanding. I have added the Action+Movie voicing to my movie source, but with less gain on the filters.

It's good that the voicing can still allow some speaker tuning as the way Rob has been talking lately it sounds more like I'd be stuck with my speaker's sound if I ever went Lyngdorf route.

There are 8 filters that can be changed in each voicing, gives a choice of Hi/Lo shelving, hi/lo pass or full parametric, Though my adjustments are no more than + or - 2db, it really doesn't need much.
 
Putting on my tin hat and seeing as this is the MP40 dedicated thread, here's my recent experience of having an MP40 and 3 x SDA2400s in my lounge for a week. My thanks to Rob for the loan. :thumbsup:

I remember excitedly driving home with all the boxes in the car after listening to all the latest demo systems at Gecko and being impressed with all of them. During the journey, I was convinced that I would shortly be ending up with either a MP40 or more likely a MP60 with a SDA8400 power amp when it was released. That wasn't to be the case unfortunately and for reasons that might make you all laugh, but that were important to me and my better half.

Simple to install and set up as usual, but then I've borrowed so much stuff from Rob and watched him do Room Perfect calibrations, I think I know what I'm doing now. It is all a breeze to set up though.

System configured for my use (5.1 only) and RP calibration completed, I set about listening tests. As expected, stereo music sounded excellent and so very much better than via my Arcam using Dirac. At last all kinds of music sounded consistently excellent. Having said that, I didn't think it was quite as good as my experience of the TDAi3400s I've tried in my system, but more on that later.

Concert Blu Rays (my favourite material to watch) all sounded better. Movies mostly sounded better, but I noticed a few times that bass impact didn't seem to be there in a few scenes that I knew well. After a few REW measurements, it looked to me that it was probably just my room layout and seating position. It affected so very few things and was so good on 99% of material that I could forgive that. Given time, I felt that I could probably improve it anyway.

Where it all fell down for me is for normal TV watching, especially in the evening. If I had a dedicated cinema room, none of the following would apply and I'd already be the owner of a MP60 (most likely) and be impatiently waiting for a SDA8400. Watching on the TV via my Virgin Media V6 box was horrible. I had to keep diving for the remote control due to significant volume differences between programmes and adverts and when switching from a normal channel to a HD channel, etc. The sound from the V6 was also thin and flat to my ears. Compared to my Arcam AVR850 which has a Dolby Volume feature that tends equalise the sound between channels and ads and that also tends fill out the sound, the MP40 was an epic fail. The DV feature is probably the one thing that I would miss about Arcam.

I think other brands have a similar feature as I don't recall such a noticeable difference when I tried Marantz, Denon and Anthem AVRs last year, but maybe I didn't get that far with them as they were returned quite quickly.

So the Lyngdorf MP40 didn't work out for me, but I don't want this review to come out as negative as it really wasn't. There was simply one key feature missing that happens to be very important for domestic harmony and our personal use. It was a pleasure to use otherwise and sounded fantastic. :D

Does this mean I'm not going to be a Lyngdorf user? Hell no! I realised that as soon as I had boxed everything up to return it and had got the Arcam back in situ, I simply could live with the Arcam and Dirac for my music listening (about 50% of my use), so I bought a Lyngdorf TDAi3400 and have integrated it with my AVR850, successfully this time (didn't spend enough time integrating it on previous loans and have learned a lot by using REW). :clap:

After 5 days am I happy? You betcha! It's sounding amazing to my ears and I still think the TDAi sounds better in stereo mode that the MP40 did. There's really not that much in it, but to my ears, it sounds slightly cleaner and more dynamic. I've no measurements to back that up, just what my ears are telling me, so could be wrong. Only 5 days, but I've yet to find anything, CDs, MP3s, Blu Rays, etc that doesn't sound better than my Arcam on its own with Dirac engaged. Happy days! :D:thumbsup:

I still think that Room Perfect is so much easier to set up and live with than Audyssey, ARC and Dirac. At least that's been my experience. I've been wanting room correction that just consistently worked for me without having to constantly worry about Harman curves, setting curtains, etc etc and RP does that for me. I have zero experience of Trinnov and haven't heard yet, so obviously can't say anything about that system.

I can say that if at some time in the future, Lyngdorf do something about the way their processors deal with TV sound from the likes of Sky or Virgin, I'll most certainly give them another try, but for now the 3400 will suit my needs. :smashin:

I guess this all means that I can only participate in the Lyngdorf stereo threads from now on. :blush:
 
Interesting read @Steve356, Thanks for sharing your experience. I will have an MP-40 here soon and will also use it in a similar way, especially with regards to normal broadcast TV. I have Verizon FiOS which has a compression setting that can be configured but never enabled it. Also, my Anthem did have Dolby Volume but again never did use it; both seemed to tame dynamics too much. I would imagine the volume difference going from different channels or even to commercials could get annoying..we shall see.

Thanks for pointing this out as it will be something I will now certainly look out for!
 
Putting on my tin hat and seeing as this is the MP40 dedicated thread, here's my recent experience of having an MP40 and 3 x SDA2400s in my lounge for a week. My thanks to Rob for the loan. :thumbsup:

I remember excitedly driving home with all the boxes in the car after listening to all the latest demo systems at Gecko and being impressed with all of them. During the journey, I was convinced that I would shortly be ending up with either a MP40 or more likely a MP60 with a SDA8400 power amp when it was released. That wasn't to be the case unfortunately and for reasons that might make you all laugh, but that were important to me and my better half.

Simple to install and set up as usual, but then I've borrowed so much stuff from Rob and watched him do Room Perfect calibrations, I think I know what I'm doing now. It is all a breeze to set up though.

System configured for my use (5.1 only) and RP calibration completed, I set about listening tests. As expected, stereo music sounded excellent and so very much better than via my Arcam using Dirac. At last all kinds of music sounded consistently excellent. Having said that, I didn't think it was quite as good as my experience of the TDAi3400s I've tried in my system, but more on that later.

Concert Blu Rays (my favourite material to watch) all sounded better. Movies mostly sounded better, but I noticed a few times that bass impact didn't seem to be there in a few scenes that I knew well. After a few REW measurements, it looked to me that it was probably just my room layout and seating position. It affected so very few things and was so good on 99% of material that I could forgive that. Given time, I felt that I could probably improve it anyway.

Where it all fell down for me is for normal TV watching, especially in the evening. If I had a dedicated cinema room, none of the following would apply and I'd already be the owner of a MP60 (most likely) and be impatiently waiting for a SDA8400. Watching on the TV via my Virgin Media V6 box was horrible. I had to keep diving for the remote control due to significant volume differences between programmes and adverts and when switching from a normal channel to a HD channel, etc. The sound from the V6 was also thin and flat to my ears. Compared to my Arcam AVR850 which has a Dolby Volume feature that tends equalise the sound between channels and ads and that also tends fill out the sound, the MP40 was an epic fail. The DV feature is probably the one thing that I would miss about Arcam.

I think other brands have a similar feature as I don't recall such a noticeable difference when I tried Marantz, Denon and Anthem AVRs last year, but maybe I didn't get that far with them as they were returned quite quickly.

So the Lyngdorf MP40 didn't work out for me, but I don't want this review to come out as negative as it really wasn't. There was simply one key feature missing that happens to be very important for domestic harmony and our personal use. It was a pleasure to use otherwise and sounded fantastic. :D

Does this mean I'm not going to be a Lyngdorf user? Hell no! I realised that as soon as I had boxed everything up to return it and had got the Arcam back in situ, I simply could live with the Arcam and Dirac for my music listening (about 50% of my use), so I bought a Lyngdorf TDAi3400 and have integrated it with my AVR850, successfully this time (didn't spend enough time integrating it on previous loans and have learned a lot by using REW). :clap:

After 5 days am I happy? You betcha! It's sounding amazing to my ears and I still think the TDAi sounds better in stereo mode that the MP40 did. There's really not that much in it, but to my ears, it sounds slightly cleaner and more dynamic. I've no measurements to back that up, just what my ears are telling me, so could be wrong. Only 5 days, but I've yet to find anything, CDs, MP3s, Blu Rays, etc that doesn't sound better than my Arcam on its own with Dirac engaged. Happy days! :D:thumbsup:

I still think that Room Perfect is so much easier to set up and live with than Audyssey, ARC and Dirac. At least that's been my experience. I've been wanting room correction that just consistently worked for me without having to constantly worry about Harman curves, setting curtains, etc etc and RP does that for me. I have zero experience of Trinnov and haven't heard yet, so obviously can't say anything about that system.

I can say that if at some time in the future, Lyngdorf do something about the way their processors deal with TV sound from the likes of Sky or Virgin, I'll most certainly give them another try, but for now the 3400 will suit my needs. :smashin:

I guess this all means that I can only participate in the Lyngdorf stereo threads from now on. :blush:
Great write up, thanks.

I had the reverse problem with my AV860 and Sky broadcasts, as all non-HD PCM material was much louder than the HD/UHD DD stuff. I’ve not noticed any volume differences with the MP-40, most broadcasts are reasonably dynamic, much more so than the 860.
 

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