What has happened to DTS:X

readingfan

Active Member
Anyone know what has happened to DTS:X
I only know of one uk disc with this feature and I'm still waiting on Denon updating my AVR -X2200W with the firmware update ?
Pretty disappointing ?
 

dante01

Distinguished Member
Denon is supposed to be updating their remaining models by the end of this month (June)?

There are now 3 DTS:X encoded titles available in the UK (Region B). Crismson Peak, The Big Short and Daddy's Home. There are more titles in the USA, but these are on Region A locked discs. I think a few titles are coming up, but some appear to be on UHD and may not include DTS:X on the standard Blu-ray release?
 

readingfan

Active Member
Thanks for the update

I wonder if DTS:X is dead before it starts , though Atmos requires a lot of additional expense presently and seems not to be worth the home cinema investment yet ?
 

dante01

Distinguished Member
Thanks for the update

I wonder if DTS:X is dead before it starts , though Atmos requires a lot of additional expense presently and seems not to be worth the home cinema investment yet ?

Lots of content is now appearing with an Atmos soundtrack, but some of the studios have decided to withhold the Atmos audio and only make it available on the UHD release. DTS;X is some way behind Atmos, but there do seem to be more titles with it coming up in the not so distant future. You have to remember that Atmos had a head start on DTS:X and there are still fewer people able to exploit DTS:X than there are those who can play Atmos encoded content.
 

readingfan

Active Member
Fair point, I have Crimson Peak on bluray and I have already 3 no 4K UHD films, but I'm waiting on the next gen screens coming through.
I have the Panny UHD player and I am going to see today what happens if I load the UHD disk and view on the HD screen what happens, just curious as the come packaged with the bluray also.
Want to see what UHD downscales to, if at all lol
 

dante01

Distinguished Member
Fair point, I have Crimson Peak on bluray and I have already 3 no 4K UHD films, but I'm waiting on the next gen screens coming through.
I have the Panny UHD player and I am going to see today what happens if I load the UHD disk and view on the HD screen what happens, just curious as the come packaged with the bluray also.
Want to see what UHD downscales to, if at all lol
My intention is to buy a UHD player first, but only when prices fall and I'm in no rush to buy or own a UHD TV. I simply want acccess to the Atmos audio now being restricted to UHD discs. You can play a UHD disc and output to non 4K HDCP 2.2 compliant hardware. The player simply downscales the video to 1080p.
 

readingfan

Active Member
Yep , just loaded San Andrea and it have made warning, suggested I loaded the bluray and warned about HDR , then proceeded to play in HD
 

readingfan

Active Member
Interestingly the picture quality and dimensionality of the image seemed better and more defined on the downscale than the bluray .
Interesting !
 

dante01

Distinguished Member
It was my understanding that with DTS:X you didn't need ceiling speakers :)
They don't heed to be on your ceiling and DTS:X will work just as effectively with height speakers, but you do still need more than just the conventional 5.1 or 7.1 base layer. Without a setup with at least 2 additional speakers then you can't access the DTS:X metadata associated with DTS:X encoded audio.
 

readingfan

Active Member
But all the articles I've read said that the USP of DTS:X was that it was capable of producing object based sound from a conventional 5.1 setup ????
 

dante01

Distinguished Member
But all the articles I've read said that the USP of DTS:X was that it was capable of producing object based sound from a conventional 5.1 setup ????
That stems from DTS saying that the speaker layout for DTS:X is less stringent than that associated with Atmos, but you'd still need extra speakers to take advantage of DTS:X and you'd still need to comply with the layouts made available by the receiver manufacturers. You can't access DTS:X via a basic 5.1 or 7.1 speaker configuration.
 

readingfan

Active Member
Won't need to worry then lol
I'm not adding any more speakers
Thanks for clearing that up.
Won't need the upgrade then lol
 

readingfan

Active Member
What hifi article on DTS:X

DTS:X is an object-based audio codec that aims to create a multi-dimensional sound that “moves around you like it would in real life”. You may think that sounds a lot like Dolby Atmos, and you’d be right. But where DTS:X differs, lies in the required speaker configuration.

While Dolby Atmos requires you to add extra height channels to your 5.1 or 7.1 setup, DTS:X will work with standard speaker setups - just like the one you might already have at home. It can support up to 32 speaker locations, which equates to 11.2 setups on 2015’s AV receivers.

DTS says it’s flexible, and will work with "any speaker configuration within a hemispherical layout".

This is thanks to DTS:X's Multi-Dimensional Audio (MDA) platform, which is open and licence-free and allows movie producers to control the placement, movement and volume of sound objects.


Read more at DTS:X: What is it? How can you get it? | What Hi-Fi?
 

readingfan

Active Member
Fortunately, around 90% of the home AV industry is supporting DTS:X, with many manufacturers either releasing firmware updates for existing receivers, or launching new models later in 2015.

Denon’s AVR-X7200W will receive a firmware update later in 2015, as will the Marantz AV8802 and the Trinnov Audio Altitude32, which will get the upgrade in the summer. Onkyo, Pioneer and Yamaha plan to release compatible receivers by Autumn 2015.

As mentioned earlier, you don’t necessarily need to add extra height channels to take advantage, but the extra channels will create a more effective 3D sound experience. You can listen to a sample of a DTS:X soundtrack on DTS's website.

DTS:X is backwards compatible, so it will work with your current 5.1 or 7.1 configuration. No need to go out and buy a new speaker package, then.

However, DTS hasn’t yet confirmed if you’ll need a new Blu-ray player to support the new audio format, or if the current run of Dolby Atmos receivers will be able to receive an update to support the rival format. Hopefully that information will arrive soon.


Read more at DTS:X: What is it? How can you get it? | What Hi-Fi?
 

dante01

Distinguished Member
What hifi article on DTS:X

DTS:X is an object-based audio codec that aims to create a multi-dimensional sound that “moves around you like it would in real life”. You may think that sounds a lot like Dolby Atmos, and you’d be right. But where DTS:X differs, lies in the required speaker configuration.

While Dolby Atmos requires you to add extra height channels to your 5.1 or 7.1 setup, DTS:X will work with standard speaker setups - just like the one you might already have at home. It can support up to 32 speaker locations, which equates to 11.2 setups on 2015’s AV receivers.

DTS says it’s flexible, and will work with "any speaker configuration within a hemispherical layout".

This is thanks to DTS:X's Multi-Dimensional Audio (MDA) platform, which is open and licence-free and allows movie producers to control the placement, movement and volume of sound objects.


Read more at DTS:X: What is it? How can you get it? | What Hi-Fi?
Yeah and I bet What HiFi wroye that prior to any receuver actually being able to handle DTS:X or before anyone had any practical experience or handling it within a home theatre :)

You need at least 2 additional height, upward firing or ceiling speakers if you want DTS:X. The configuration you use for them is determined by the options offered by the receiver's manufacturer and they basically give you the same configuration and layout options as they give you for Atmos. Note that without a setup with the additional speakers then you wont even get DTS:X even if the audio has the metadata included. Your setup will simply show DTS-HD Master Audio as being the available audio and not DTS:X. I've got a Yamaha RXA1050 which is DTS:X enabled and without the extra speakers then you don't get DTS:X. I use 2 additional front height speakers as well as a 5.1 base layer. Turn off the height speakers and I can no longer access DTS:X.

The AVRX7200 down to the AVRX4200 have already received the DTS:X update you mention and some but not all of Marantz's models also have it. Yamaha have also updated some of their upper tier Adventage models and have announced that some of their new lower tier RXV x81 models will be getting DTS:X when they are made available over the next few months.
 
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readingfan

Active Member
I don't doubt what you say as it does contradict itself in saying that you don't need the height speakers but you get a better effect with them,
But there was a later article , when they had been to DTS facility and the DTS guy said you didn't need the height speakers to get some of the benefit as this was their unique codec and that they felt because cinemas wouldn't have to change their existing speaker arrays that they were confident they could win out over Dolby?
 

readingfan

Active Member
From the Denon website


DTS:X is the next generation object-based, multi-dimensional audio technology from DTS. Unbound from channels, DTS:X conveys the fluid movement of sound to create an incredibly rich, realistic and immersive soundscape – in front of, behind, beside and above the audience - more accurately than ever before. DTS:X offers the ability to automatically adapt the audio to the speaker layout that best fits the space, from a television’s built-in speakers to a home surround theater system to a dozen or more speakers in a commercial cinema. With DTS technology, even the smallest screens will sound huge. Immerse yourself at www.dts.com/dtsx.
 

dante01

Distinguished Member
I don't doubt what you say as it does contradict itself in saying that you don't need the height speakers but you get a better effect with them,
But there was a later article , when they had been to DTS facility and the DTS guy said you didn't need the height speakers to get some of the benefit as this was their unique codec and that they felt because cinemas wouldn't have to change their existing speaker arrays that they were confident they could win out over Dolby?
DTS have never said what you think they have. AS many have also done, you've misinterpreted what DTS have implied about the freedom to place speakers less rigidly as being an indication that additional speakers are not required. They have also implicitly said that the end layout is left up to the manufacturers to deal with and isn't simply a matter of having DTS:X decoding. No manufacturer has offered different layout configuration options for speakers in relation to DTS:X than those associated with Atmos and or Auro3D.
 

readingfan

Active Member
Again not disagreeing , but if you visit the link and watch the demo on the current DTS demo they most definitely imply that you can get DTS:X immersive sound from virtually any layout, including mobiles and computers ,that's very misleading if it's not the case.
www.dts.com/dtsx.
 

dante01

Distinguished Member
I've got DTS authored DTS:X demo material that simply depicts a room with a conventional 7.1 base layer plus 4 height speakers. The setup resembles that which you'd associate with Auro3D sans the voice of god ceiling speaker.

 
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readingfan

Active Member
This is extract from amplifier handbook ?

This mode can be selected when playing back content encoded with DTS:X.It decodes DTS:X content and its positioning data in real time and outputs audio from the appropriate speakers, creating natural audio images regardless of the speaker layout. Use height speakers to realize a three-dimensional sound field.

Again confusing wording , says you need height speakers for 3 dimensional sound , but implies a different audio image to standard DTS regardless of speaker layout.
So perhaps there is still some sound quality ,moving image soundscape benefit without additional speakers but not fully 3D then?
 

dante01

Distinguished Member
In theory, you should still be able to control objects defined by DTS:X if only being handled by a 5.1 or 7.1 base layer. One example would be if dialogue is set as being an object. Receiver's have options to control DTS:X dialogue, but these are only effective if the DTS:X audio was actually mixed and authored with dialogue as an object. No mix as yet included dialogue mixed as being an object. Also note that without the extra speakers being included in a setup then the receiver simply doesn't recognise the presence of the DTS:X metadata and you simply get the DTS-HD Master Audio 7.1 base audio and the the DTS:X metadata that defines the objects is ignored and not read.
 

readingfan

Active Member
Thanks for all the info , clears up the misconception , I guess a lot of people will have misconstrued the DTS:X advertising as I have.
Don't care that much , as I've waited too long now to be really all that bothered one way or the other.
Up firing speakers are too expensive at present and they may not work alongside my rounded B&W m1 speakers anyway, certainly can't sit on top lol and I only bought them about a year ago so I not changing anytime soon.
I don't want the hassle of concealing wiring and fitting height speakers , so I guess this new sound era may go the same way as 3D glasses lol
 

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